L.O.G. 238 Film and Behavior

Well, hello everyone. Thank you for tuning in to The Human Behavior Podcast. And good morning, Greg. I'm curious real quick, what the current temp is up in the Rockies in Colorado?

Holy crap! So, I've got this link to the outside. Let me tell you, because it just turned 15. Oh, that's actually 15 times warmer than yesterday.

Yeah, you know what I'm saying? Yesterday, 15 was our high.

So, I hope not happening. Dark out.

We, in San Diego, got down into the low 30s the last couple nights. So, we had some frost, which is not good for the avocado trees out here. So, that's the big—

30 is really damaging. Is "frost on the avocado" a euphemism for something? A famous song, I think.

That's not something that I want to know what that even means. But, today's topic is, we're actually doing a follow-up from the previous episode on music, is now do movies. And I don't know why I didn't think of that when we were doing the music one, but it's a natural sort of progression. Because we [expletive] smoked some good weed, and both of us forgot. Movies are... I mean, because it's storytelling. And I don't like how music is, but there's similar— it's a great, it's another great analogy to human behavior pattern recognition, because they all revolve around patterns, patterns, excuse me. And so, there's a ton we can learn from movies about human behavior, about ourselves, and what we're watching in society as a whole.

You don't have to drill down into the details of the movies; you just look at it from a sort of formulaic perspective and the elements of what needs to be in there. Because there are elements from real life, now maybe exaggerated or personified in some other manner, or however they want to tell the story. But either way, there's certain elements that have to be there. So, every movie and successful movie and TV show, unless you're into some very, very unique things, it has to follow—

Let's not go there. We're back to the avocado.

Well, they have to follow a certain algorithm. And, you know, you have within those, within those different algorithms, within those elements that have to be in there, this is also why, and we'll talk about this in the episode, why we see like prequels and sequels, why Hollywood keeps doing remakes of stuff, which is actually a great point on that. I think is that it shows how hard it is to be creative and unique and novel, even in a creative industry such as Hollywood movie making. It's very difficult to come up with something new that works and is entertaining. So, it's really, really difficult. And then we'll also talk about, I want to get into why people binge-watch, how we see ourselves within the movies, and kind of what it all means. So, I'm not sure where you wanted to start today, but I know you do have kind of a quote about movies and about their link and stuff. So, I don't know if you want to start there. I'll let you—

That's a great place to start. So, look, these Greg-isms don't end because I just say what's on my mind. And a long time ago, I film... Yeah, it's not always a trait that you clap afterwards, but you know, I love film. And so, I've been a lover of film since I was a little kid. And my quote was: Most films are about an hour too long. Because I love film, and I love how people tell film, but it's almost as if in many films that I watch, that somebody's looking at the clock and going, "Dude, we got to have 20 more minutes. One more fistfight!" And I hate that [expletive]. I love when I get the point of a film, and it's beautifully shot and well acted, and the script is good, I can go back to it over and over, and we'll talk about that.

But what I found, and you have a great way of sizing it up: every generation vilifies the next generation or the previous generation, right? Well, it's the same with me because my taste in music is all over the place. Well, my taste in film is all over the place too. And what I reach out to is that stress-reducing, enjoyment-gathering. If it's a CGI film, unless it's some stunning, amazing thing, I'm not excited. I don't get those. And so, listen, and we also share a trait that our listeners and our viewers and our stalkers probably would be interested in, is that you and your wife do exactly what Shelley and I do, is we have a time where we watch films at home, and we have the 15-minute rule. And I've heard recently that you have the same rule.

You know, so to kind of jump into a good starting point too, is those films and what we— because you're bringing it up right here— is that when we say they have to follow a certain algorithm, there has to be certain elements. It's about setting patterns. So, it has to be engaging to me, just like music. But it has to fit within, within what the confines of what I expect to see. And then when there's a little bit of irony or a little bit of discourse or a little bit of incongruence, it's good. My brain clamps on, "Oh, I wasn't expecting that. Yes, I want to..." So, now it's engaging. But if it's too much or too little, then it's like if it's too much, then I'm like, "This is all over the place. I don't understand it." If it's too little, it's too boring.

Right around Christmas time, they show a couple of films about, for example, in Christianity, about Jesus. And I won't name any of the films for attribution, but they're four and a half hours long. Oh, yeah. Look, I love Jesus, but I didn't want to follow him the whole day. Get what I'm trying to say? I wanted to, you know, get in, get out after dinner or something. Just give me some of the highlights. Give me the top five miracles. If you're going on just strict, "Hey, look at the beauty in this nine and a half hour epic," I'm not interested, you know? I want something that captures my attention early, that keeps my attention, or inattention, and that's an odd policy, right? Because sometimes we choose a film as background noise, and that's an important discussion as well. So, I just like the idea, and the 15-minute rule for those that are wondering is that Shelley and I, like Erik Korem, great doctor, keep up the great posts, always says, "3-2-1." So, three hours before bed, no food. Two hours, no drink. One hour, no film. Well, Erik, I have a life, and as much as I'd like to follow that, when Shelley and I finally get together, we sit in a dark room, we eat the popcorn, literally eat the popcorn, and watch a film. If that film doesn't gather both of our attention in 15 minutes, we broom it and go on to the next one.

And I think that's a great policy because we jointly look, if you're looking at the societal necessity of film, that's a perfect example. It brings us closer together. And we spent hours after, whether it was a [expletive] film or a great film, talking about it. How, what else gives you that benefit for your, you know, the return for your investment?

Well, and it's, it's the... It goes back to the oldest form of knowledge and skill transfer: storytelling, right? So, you're having this storytelling with this engaging experience, with music, and the lights, and, and it's, it's executed in a manner that's meant to be engaging for the watchers. So, you can really, you can really get into it. You can get lost to it. You, it opens up a new world. You can suspend disbelief. Your brain goes, "Got it. We're watching a movie." But it meaning it knows like, "This isn't a real thing. So, it's safe. It's okay. I can enjoy it. I can, and I, I can even, even expand my boundaries to what I might be interested in versus in a normal situation, right? In an environment." And so, so you can, that it's, that's why part of the reason, you know, you're talking about psychological and sociological engagement right there. One, especially you're enjoying it with your wife. A lot of people do that. I do that with my Kaylie. And the same thing is like, if it's, if it's not capturing my attention in those first 15 minutes, I'm not in. But we sort of have different standards where like, she might be in the mood where she wants to watch something that really grabs her in. Sometimes we'll watch a movie where it's, it's grabbing me in because it's, because of how it's, how slow it is going or what it's laying out. I'm like, "Hang on, this is different. They're really putting something out here." So, what do you do? You buy another 15 minutes.

Right. And I love that. But see, that's the epitome of social connectivity because you want to belong. And so there, even in your relationship, you feel emotionally close to somebody else, and the film actually augments that. It has that, the film is a vehicle just like a good book. But you know what? That's why we have to form a book club. Because unless I'm reading it to you, and then you're reading me the next chapter, like I give you an example, that's a parallel. Shelley and I still love doing crosswords. And we were on a lot of flights where there weren't cell phones and there weren't movies and there weren't other things. So, what I would do is I would do like the first three words, and then pass it to her for the next three. And the idea was to see where her mind was and which clues she was getting a piece of, and see the hesitation marks where she wanted to fill in something that would give me the chance to ask, "What do you think that is?" And then we would talk. And people go, "You guys really take crosswords seriously?" And it's like, yeah, because guess what, it's a safe harbor for us to pull into while we have to burn some time, and it's socially connective. We love that connective fire.

So, you're and you're talking about sort of, which is great, this, this connection with the people you're watching the movie with. And you're also connecting with the characters in the story, right? And so, this is and, and this is one of the, when, when we say, because we say this all the time, that all human beings have a very egocentric viewpoint. It's part of just our survival. It goes back to the limbic system. We're concerned about us. Well, when it comes to watching a movie, it's, it's the perfect example because who do we see ourselves as, right? We, we're, we're watching this movie going, "I'm the protagonist. I'm the Jason Bourne. I'm this." You know, you're not looking at it going, "Hey, see that guy, you know, cleaning up dishes on that back table in the restaurant of the scene? Hey, that's me."

So, you get to see yourself as the hero, right? I mean, you really do. And you feel, you feel betrayed when he's betrayed or she's betrayed. You feel enthralled when they discover something or get away, you know, you're right there on their heels. Or remember Peter Pan where he lost his shadow and Tink had to help him find it and sew it back onto his heels? That's how we feel in those films. But it's not the obverse of that. The real universe is we should be watching that film and going, "Okay, pause. You see that guy behind Jason Statham, you know, Jason Statham that's bussing the table? Okay, that's more me." You get what I'm trying to say? The guy that's the valet parking that car or mowing the lawn or something.

And it's funny because the film, just like the book, allows that escapist fantasy. So, that's why when you're talking about stress reduction or increasing one's emotional intelligence, Brian, that plus the benefits of talking about a film, one of the reasons that this podcast is named "The Human Behavior Podcast" (originally "Left of Greg") is we'd be driving around, we'd be talking about class. But you can't talk about class all the time. Then something interesting drives by, and we go, "You know, that was exactly like that movie!" This, and then we go off on a movie or a song, don't we? I mean, that's one of the 90 percentile things that Brian and I, folks, talk about when we're engaged somewhere and why we use the story. We go, "So last night on Family Guy," and that reminds me of the story. Everything has a relevant meaning, either our lives or our class.

Most, it's well done. Most of our training classes are based predominantly on Family Guy. So, Family Guy and about two-thirds Family Guy, one-third The Simpsons. So, watch those, exactly, the early Simpsons. So, if you watch those episodes, you don't need to come to class, folks. Just watch them and just send me a text and we'll send you a thumbs up. A yellow thumbs up for The Simpsons.

So that, and, and this is, this is kind of what I wanted to get into as well, because not just the storytelling aspect, but, but how we, how knowledge and skill transfer works and why you can't remember some really important information that you need to know, but you remember every line of the movie Step Brothers or something like that, or quote. And those, and we talk about memory emotion links on this, and that's what we were talking about with, with music as well, is, and since the music episode too, I got some great feedback from everyone listening. I appreciate that. And, and, you know, hearing a song allows you to recall so much more memory. And we talked about memory emotion links and how those, uh, uh, what happens in the brain with memorization and creating neural pathways to all these different areas. Well, movies have that same effect because it's an experience. It's the sights, it's the sounds, smell. It's that popcorn that you're eating, right? And it all gets sort of codified in there. So, when it's really funny or really scary, you remember all of those elements better.

But, you know, that's something that, like, I mean, we, we made the joke about Family Guy or those movies, but we use those movie references throughout what we do because it ties, it can, you can, you can tie a scene in a movie to a lesson. I even did, actually, we, I, I just remember this. When, I think I was going through like even sniper school in the Marine Corps, it was like meant to be a Kim's game. But they, the instructor showed us, you know, if everyone's listening to Kim's game, it's, you know, the idea is, you know, you get good at recall by, you know, looking at a bunch of objects, remembering what they were, and then recalling them later. It's kind of like little games for attention and for, for, for memory.

And it just came from the character Tim. Exactly.

Yeah, Rudyard Kipling character. But, uh, you know, they showed us this clip from the movie Heat. You remember the scene where they, the bank, and they're, they're coming out and, you know, the point was, they were going to ask us a bunch of questions about it and, "Hey, what was the billboard on the bus that drove by when they were shooting?" And this. So, that the idea was just a game of attention and awareness and taking in the full entire scene. Don't get looped in watching the popcorn. But, you know, even, even that, and part of the reason, one it was interesting too, because that was when movies started using people with real tactical experience to help them choreograph those films. Because in that scene, it's very actually tactically sound how they break contact out of there. It's fire and maneuver, and it's like textbook how you're supposed to do that. Because they had brought someone, I think he was like, I don't remember who it was, maybe British SAS or something like that. It was, I, I remember it was someone from England, I think. But to show them, "Hey, this is how you do that. This is how you break contact to, to kind of show the organization level of them." But it, the, the point I'm, I'm getting with that is those are powerful tools to use, even when teaching a lesson or pulling out good information from those, right? And this is why they're so popular and they turn into memes. And, and, and, you know, there's, there, you can get spread around because everyone, it's a shared common experience that everyone has. And if you can tie a lesson back to that, it, it, it's so much, much more powerful because it, it now again, helps the recall what I'm trying to learn. So, that's why I love them too and why we use them in, in pop culture. And, and, and, you know, everyone's always talking about whatever the latest movie is, because it allows you to discuss certain topics underneath this sort of safety net of a movie. Does that kind of make sense?

Exactly, because now it can occur in the movie. Like, for example, if you're, if you're testing what you like or if you want to understand more about another person, you can gauge that with music and with film without being insulting. And, you know, another Family Guy reference: "May I take a gander under your skirt?" And it was at the Renaissance Festival, and they actually stick a goose under the lady's skirt. That's magic. But the idea that we could discuss something like that, and you go, "That's ridiculous." Well, now I know we're not going to go to Airplane! at the drive-through, right, or at the drive-in.

And I'll give you a quick example what Brian's talking about, boys and girls. So, you know, it's like the 25th anniversary of The Sopranos. So, you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a Sopranos reference. Well, I was a true acolyte. I absolutely watched absolutely every episode that came out. And Shelley and I would create a watching time. And ours was on Sunday night when generally we had this time away from the kids. And we would sit with a couple of good friends of ours and we would watch, and then we discuss the episode. Well, in Season 6, Episode 6, there's a scene where Christopher Moltisanti and Tony Soprano meet at Bada Bing. And Tony goes, "Hey, are you sure about that?" You know, my channeling my Tony, I don't want it to sound like Gilbert Gottfried. That's your go-to character, how I sound. I think. But he says, "Hey, Chris," he goes, "There's two Arab gentlemen that you're dealing with. How do we know they're not Al-Qaeda?" Which is great, because again, it's a Sopranos becomes a period film, right? What was popular back then? And so, it's, you know, opening the history. And Moltisanti goes right into fundamental attribution error. He goes, "Oh, no, Tone. These are good guys, man. I was over their house, and they were having ham chops and steak." You know, so he's going against all the different things that we've learned about the Arab culture that we think is important, for example, to a Muslim. And he was dancing around it, and it was hilarious because of how tongue-in-cheek it was. And then he says, "They even own a Labrador Retriever." Okay, so the idea is that because they're a nice guy and they own a dog and all this [expletive], well, they certainly can't be terrorists, right? You say it, you say it the best when you're talking about, you know, you go over to a guy's house and they, you know, they donated to whatever fund that you wanted. You go, "That's a nice person," not knowing that they got human skin lampshades right inside the door.

Yeah, but why is that?

And yes, I consider The Sopranos a film, and not the new remake of The Sopranos film, right? But the idea is that a film can allow us to test things that we would never be able to test in real life and demonstrate things to somebody. Because like if I try to demonstrate something I know to you, I might be hitting a brick wall because your experiences and mine are so different. But we can come together in the film and we can say, "Do you remember that scene? Well, what they meant by that scene, what was happening behind there?" And then the other person says, "You're full of [expletive]. I've been to Boston." And I know that's the socialization, because if, if you are talking about just an escape mechanism, yes, it's proven physiologically to do certain things. But if you're talking about strengthening a relationship, a film is a great way to open all kinds of metaphors. Brian, how many times I got to talk allegory of the cave? We keep looking at Boyd's OODA Loop. Boyd's OODA Loop equals [expletive] movie. Okay, allegory of the cave. There's thousands of films that—

But that's, that's, um, that's a great point. And I think it's more about how it's received versus how it's produced and conducted and delivered. So, to, to the, to the, to your Boyd's OODA Loop example, and it's like anytime a recent, a new study or a new thing comes out or someone writes a paper about something, what I've kind of found in a lot of this is like the intent of what was the initial research or whatever it was was great and was meant for a specific thing. And then everyone took it wrong and then it grew from there. It's like, "Well, that's not really what, what, what I meant by that," you know what I'm saying? Again, a fundamental attribution. I've taken something that you spent a lot of time researching and creating, and now my bias is so there. He just proved my point. Wait a minute, you never had that point. Right? That's the—

Well, that's the Boyd's OODA Loop one. I think if he were alive today and he saw people what they're doing, he'd be like, "Ma'am, that what?" Like, he'd be like, "Can you explain that to me? I don't know what you're talking about." OODA Loop helps me as a swimmer.

So, here's, here's, here's one thing because you, you actually, what another reason why I love film is this. It's great. It's great pop culture, you know, references throughout time that you can go back to because what, and you kind of, kind of hit on it there. So, I want to, want to jump into it. But sure, you know, a lot of folks will like look back at like older movies and be like, "This blows," or, "This is slow," or, "This doesn't have this." And it's a great way when you look back at different historical events and, or different situations that happen or something someone did, and then you're, you're judging it based on what you know. And you got to go, "Look, you got to understand this car chase scene in The French Connection. This was groundbreaking. No one had done something like that before. Not a single word spoken for however long it is. And it's just this, this, uh, they, you're, you're dropped into this, um, intense sort of moment and you're on the edge of your seat and that hadn't like—" So, no, that's not the flipping 37 cars and CGI stuff you have now, because it wasn't available then, and that was, that was groundbreaking. So, you're, you're looking at it as a time capsule sort of now and opening up and going, "Well, well so much—"

I love "time capsule." That's so great.

And then you look back to what people had to do. So, I love films for that reason because you can see the sort of the ebb and flow of how they start to change things. There's certain ones that are, uh, uh, you know, that that have sort of an impact across the industry. But, but when it comes to those, you know, I, I always love it when someone from like, you know, today is like, "Well, those older movies, they suck and they're too slow." It's like, "No, man. Like, you got to enjoy it for what it was." Right?

So, another Greg-ism coming. Feel free to write them down and use them in your day: "Just because it's old doesn't mean it's good." Because like, Turner Classic. Okay, so that's my only, you know, that's my go-to because I don't stream or web or whatever the new [expletive] term is. But I love film. And people ask all the time, "Why do you call it film instead of movies?" I use both, but I prefer saying film because it's shot on film. It means something to me rather than like video and the other formats. And also, "movies" is kind of a bastardization of language: "What are they doing? Well, they're moving. Oh, so these are stills and these are movies." Right? And so, I just prefer the one.

You still call them talkies, too. I was there playing the piano.

So, the idea is that we get hooked that because it's a black and white, it's a classic. Or we start right up making some [expletive] Hollywood movie and we go, "An instant classic." Nothing can be an instant classic. "Down elevator." Okay, those things can't exist. It's "jumbo shrimp." They can't be there. So, so I say to you, the thing that brings you back to a film, like for example, probably two weeks ago now, The King and I. It was with Chow Yun-Fat and Jodie Foster, that old one. It was on a free channel. I taped it. So, when I came back from our trip, Shelley and I could watch it. Splendid film. Film, not the musical version, not the stage version. Then I do my research on it because I want to know where it was filmed. Like I hate a film about Detroit that was filmed in Canada. I hate any film that was filmed in Canada. It's not about Canada, it's just ridiculous. A standard that we set to send all our money to Canada. But back to this, you know, I'm watching the film and then I read up about the female that wrote the book that the film's based on, and she was batshit crazy. She made up everything. She made up living in Egypt for years and her relationship and the definitions of the people that she meant. And things weren't historically accurate. Okay. But you know what? I understand when I click play that that's a film. It's not a documentary. I understand that I'm not opening Britannica. Do you see what I'm trying to say? A lot of people get that right.

I agree with you.

But I enjoy the idea that The King and I has been done, that film has been done a number of times. We need to talk about that too, why that is. But the idea is it hooked me. Jodie Foster, great character, loved her for her entire career. Gets off the bass every once in a while. But it's okay. "Elysium!" I scream out, "Elysium!" Shelley knows immediately what I mean because of all my ailments that could be healed. I loved her in Taxi Driver. I mean, look at what, what a character that she created and portrayed before anybody understood that it was acting, you know what I mean? So, there's such magic there. But the idea was that to find out the [expletive] of reality for me, that it was all hocus pocus and [expletive]. But I appreciate that because that again gives me something to think about and invest my time in and research and talk to other people about and see how they feel about it. No other milieu other than music and film and and literature, of course, allows you to do that.

Brian, most people aren't that creative. That's, that's the big thing. And to, to tell a compelling story, to engage people is, is a lot more difficult than people realize, right? And that's why, you know, you see the repetitive nature of these films, to literally, "Hey, let's do the reboot. Hey, it's been 20 years, let's do this. Hey, let's, let's get all the same actors back and they'll play this." It's like the different, it's like when they did that with Blues Brothers, they ruined the first one when they did it because it was so profoundly different. And it was like, "No, man, that was such a, it was a snapshot in time of, of a place that involved the music and this, and the comedy, the stuff from Chicago and the folks at Second City we're putting out all the stuff like where these, a lot of these actors and SNL folks got their start and where this blossomed from National Lampoon's guys." Like, it was this thing. Like, you can't, you can't just redo that and slap like Animal House 2. Yeah, it would be terrible. Like you can't—

But Brian, I'll take this stand, and we can discuss it from different points of view: mine from a strictly financial or fiduciary relationship with film. So much easier for me to pitch something that's already been done and demonstrate that it made money. I don't have to scout locations. I know the kind of actor I want. The scripts have already been written, so maybe I got to pump up the script a little bit, right? But the idea is that, okay, so, you know, a film like A Star Is Born that's been done for every single generation. Okay, we got it. So the idea of all that extra money and work and hours can be put into a different part of the production, or can be put in my pocket, right? Or the studio can save it. So many times, the root is being lazy and just chasing the dollar. I mean, we have to, we have to be realistic, of course.

But it also highlights the fact that there are really only so many stories to tell, now, meaning that milieu—

I absolutely agree.

I mean, just across across society, you, you can, you can encapsulate people's stories, you know, that are might be seen, that the details are all wildly different, but it's the same thing. It's, "Hey, had this thing happen, got knocked down, had to get back up, got on top." I mean, that, that, that the hero's—

By the way, brilliant.

But it's like the whole hero's journey is replayed in every movie that's ever made, you know, not everyone, but with The Iliad, The Odyssey.

Right. So, the difference in literature, Brian, is literature fills libraries with hundreds of thousands of people's stories. But not all of them are compelling. So, societally, because not all of them can we feel ourselves being a part of it. What I'm saying, some like My Left Foot might be an amazing struggle, but I can't associate with the character. So, I like the book much more than I like the film.

This is how this is how it relates back to sort of human behavior and, and how humans are because there's only, you know, there's only so many different types of people. We can, we, we all fall into that, that ice cube tray somewhere. I mean, it really, we really, really do. And, and so there's, there's, there's limits to what you can and can't do. And movies play with that and they push it. And sometimes they do well and sometimes they do poor. Sometimes. And, and everything gets exaggerated. And sometimes that, sometimes even actors then become that same character over and over.

Exactly. In their entire career is a perfect example, because that's all he's got. So, and you compare that to a John Candy that could assume a whole bunch of different, in my humble opinion. So, I want to touch on something that you just said. The idea that we repeat themes is so huge because we are a culture of patterns. And you said something that's going to insult a bunch of people: as much as we think we're different and unique, we're all the same. We're not. And somebody's going to say, "Well, wait a minute, I'm very different." Okay. There's five or six restaurants that are repeated in every gosh-darn intersection for money, at every small town while you're driving down the freeway. Why? Because that's where people like to eat. There's a Walmart in every town. And because Walmart has, I don't want to say disturbing unique policies. If you want to hunt the serial killer, go park at the Walmart, you're going to find them sooner or later. But why Walmart? Because they offer great value for a low price, and you know where everything is in the store. I bet you can walk in any Walmart, and the same reason I go to the same hotel all the time. You walk in any Walmart, you know right where everything is. You get in and out, no time at all. Hate self-checkout, another story.

But the idea there, Brian, is that once that movie crosses that familiar territory, like for example, there's schlock, there's stuff that they put in films that's just not true, and it's become a Hollywood legend. So now it becomes a standard. The police officer with the bottle of booze in their desk. Okay, yeah, HR would have a field day. Your bosses would, you know, you got to take a blood, urine, semen and stool sample every time you're in a use of force or a shooting, that doesn't happen. Every movie's insistence, from Jade to The Seagal Flick to gosh, you just mentioned the one, Blues Brothers, where the pursuit pops up on a curb and goes through a restaurant, then hits a flower cart or food cart, then goes through, and then you remember Jake and Elwood Muppet and turn it on the wieners? Okay, those type of things we look forward to in a film, even though the reality is that they never occur in real life. So what? So they become the urban legend, and when we don't see them, we get angry. So if you have to put it in a movie, you know, that, that, that the, what do we call it, that buddy flick, you know, and then all of a sudden you're, you're, you're saying, "Okay, well, it's got to be a fish out of water." So, you know, one guy's got to be black and one guy's got to be white. One guy's got to be the dragon slayer, and guess what, his best friend ends up being the dragon that saves his life. Aesop wrote about that. Come on, those aren't new concepts. But why, Brian? Because those are the ones that hook us chemically. They hook our brain, they hook us physiologically.

That, that's that, that's sort of that, that looking for that familiarity, right? It can't have, can't have too much incongruence unless like it's obvious upfront going in that everything in there is completely made up. And that's why those "based on real events" movies always do so well. And they're such a far stretch from what actually happened. Just watch any—

You're exactly right. Watch any, any, any movie about the military in the last 20 years that's not—

Well, Tom Berenger, right? He showed everything you need to know about being a sniper.

Exactly. Exactly. But you're right. So, listen, Max is eight months now. You know, he's going to come up with a favorite toy or a favorite blanket, and that's going to go with him everywhere. And he's going to come up with a favorite sleeping position in different locations, in the car seat, in the crib, on the couch right next to you. And the idea is when you look at those, those are comfort signals. And with a comfort signal, not only does my heart rate feel the definite benefit of it, but the electrochemical neurotransmitters in my body actually respond to them. Yeah. So, the film that you repeat over and over and over, or the song, and hence the lyrics, becomes that security blanket. And so when I want to check out, when I want to relax, when I've got a project with a deadline and I want something burning in the background, I need it to be familiar. Why? Because my brain needs to be able to check out, not burn a whole bunch of calories and solve equations and do a [expletive] Sudoku. Yes. Right? It needs to give me some payback. And my payback is that it's the warm comfort of the voices and the characters and the situations. And I go, "Ah," is it cortisol and and race through my system?

So, here's, here's where I want to get into kind of what we do with HBPRNA and teach people predictive analysis and how to do that and extract. And because you're, you just set it up right there. So, when I'm watching the movie, I'm, I'm, you know, if it's good, I'm so bought into the moment that I didn't see that thing coming. I didn't, unless they wanted you to, unless they put out the breadcrumbs for something, unless it was deliberate, right? That, "Oh my God, I didn't know that was going to happen." Or, "That's the big surprise. That's the big [expletive]!" That's why it works, because I'm so bought in. I'm so down and in this movie. I'm not taking a step back and looking around and going, "Wait a minute, what's likely happening next? Where are these characters going?" And so, so you can kind of use those as sort of a predictive analysis tool even when you're watching a movie. Now, it takes away from your enjoyment of the movie because you're doing the map chart in your head going, "Wait a minute, that just doesn't make sense." That you also have to suspend disbelief.

But here's what I kind of wanted to get at: the background fluff, the set dressing in a film, the background characters are just as important as anything else that's going on. In fact, that's what sets the baseline for everything. So, in order to have like a compelling conversation between two characters where you're bought in and they're all they're doing is having a coffee in a diner, you have to hear the plates rattling, you have to hear someone pouring coffee, you have to see the waitress walking around, you have to see the yourself— So the, the idea is so when it comes to, that's what we kind of have people focus on, right? It's like, "Okay, extract normalcy from the environment, the smell, the feel, the taste, the atmospherics."

Exactly.

So, that background, literally like set dressing, you know, almost on those films. That's how life works. Is like, all of that background noise, everything that's happening, that's where you get what's going on in the situation. It's not the thing that pops up in the main character that walks. Because that's easy.

You're making me so angry now because what you're doing unintentionally or deliberately, because Brian, you got to know, fires on a bunch of channels. He's like a sprinkler all at once. Is you're making our argument why sometimes VR and AI builders make a mistake. Yes, because they think that VR and AI are a film. It's a movie. And so therefore that character has to be so compelling that I want to pay attention to that character in that moment. "Does he have a gun? What's going on?" All that. But in reality, when we're dealing with police work or emergency services or response, it's all those things on the way to the call that matter. It's all that when I got out, when I dismounted, "Did I have to run to the scene or walk to the scene? Were sirens blaring or weren't they blaring?" So when you and I are talking about being purists in there, we're talking about exactly that HBPRNA. That we're talking about films and novels and all the other things. In a novel, if we just came up and said, "Junior was raped in prison. Tomorrow he got a job. Thursday he got fired." Okay, listen. If you don't do the color along with the play-by-play, people are tuning the [expletive] out. That's, that's why you got to do, that's why you got to do the montage, right? Where they play the music and they go through all that stuff and you see, "Oh, they're prepping for this. They're buying the guns or they're running on the beach and they're high-fiving," whatever. Yeah, that's perfect. I have to, for example, the old guy, but he's still in pretty good shape. So you got to watch him. Go back to The Sopranos. There was one episode where Junior shoots Tony Soprano and he's trying to get back into it. And he's well over 300 pounds and he's not healthy. And so he's back at the Bada Bing or Satriale's, one of the places that the film's already going. And he's got one of the security guards there. It's a young kid that was used to, you know, play college ball. He was a big kid. So he looks around and all the young guys are in shape and all the old gangsters are fat and out of shape and droopy. So he goes, "Man, I got to appear strong." So what's he do? He picks a fight with that kid, bum-rushes him and knocks him out. Okay, that's great. You know why? Because we've all felt those emotions. So building up to it, they've took days and weeks and months of other episodes to show you that one point in film, and I think that's magic. Right when Michael Corleone in The Godfather has to walk into the bathroom and find the gun behind the [expletive] and go out and kill those two guys. And you knew about it, you knew about it because an hour into the movie they were already planning that assassination. But Brian, like Hitchcock, you had to wait for that holy [expletive]. This is why when films allow the escapist fantasy and they're realistic, cognitively close enough, and we can associate with a part of it, or we can step into a role that we've always wondered about, and then step right back out safely. Man, that's magic. That's what I'm talking about, the security blanket, and those are the films we go back to over and over and over.

Yeah. No, and, and, and that's, that's, that's it. It's, it's, um, you know, obviously we suspend disbelief. It's close enough to, it's cognitively close enough to reality, but allows us to play all these different areas. And, and so we can obviously that's meant to be used as a, as a, as a tool. And, and everything that goes on in those films is supporting the storyline and driving it forward, right? And, and so, you know, it, it allows us, that's where, you know, you can create suspense by putting in these little clues, cues, you know, within there. And, and they're all there. And it just, "Oh, man, that was the, you know, The Sixth Sense where everyone goes, 'Oh, man, whenever the red was on,' you were spot on with that."

Okay. So, here, here's the thing. First of all, shout out to Dr. Darcy Luutsinger. Dr. Darcy Luutsinger brought realism to so many films for a decade. His company exemplified training people on how to clear buildings and do those things as a cop with a lot of training experience. Love that. Love when you do that. If you don't do that, then what you do is you make a hot bag of [expletive] that while we're watching it, we go, "Nobody would do that." Like, for example, "I need to show you holding a gun. So, put it in the frame, holding up by my head." I, "I know dead people." To your, I've seen that because of that. But a quick Sixth Sense film, you were talking about, most people don't dissect everything. We're loving life, Brian and I and the people that we work with, because we do dissect everything, and we found that that's a tremendous thing. Nothing surprises. You have a good time. So, we are in Vail, Colorado. And Vail has a theater I used to that had reclining chairs and had drink holders. And there was a bar and they would mix you your drinks for you. And there was only a limited amount of people that could go in. It was real fruit. And it was right down the street from Avon where we were coppers and we were working on the drug team. So, it was Shelley and I, and it was Jay Lucky Sias and his wife. And so, they go, "Hey, you got to, you know, Jay. Hey, man, you got to see, man. What's that?" He mumbles, "Hey, we got to go see this film. It just came out at this cool theater." So, we went up, and an experience was completely different for Shelley and I that had gone to Detroit theaters. So, it was The Sixth Sense. So, we're to the point in The Sixth Sense where they introduced Haley Joel Osment. Okay? Just after the shooting, just after the bed. Spoil alert, turn the channel. And Shelley looks at me and goes, "Something with the color red." And I go, "Yeah. And I think he got killed." And she goes, "What do you mean?" I go, "Well, think about it. He's already dead." And then Sias goes, "Yeah, that's it! So, he sees dead people." And it was well before they said it. The people around us [expletive]! Okay? They were all so pissed. They wanted to get up and walk out of the theater. And it was like, "Oh, sorry." What were we doing? We were familiar enough with this movie, having never seen it before, that we were discussing. Here again, socialization. A film allowed us to be closer in that moment and and use our skill to dissect it. But guess what? We pissed everybody else off because we called it like we saw it, and we should have shut up. You know.

No, and it's, it's anything that gets injected into the story. I can't remember what, what we were watching one time, and I'm going like, [expletive] I'm like, "What the, like what's going on here?" And like Kaylie's like, "What, what?" I go, "All right, remember like 15 minutes ago where the guy came by and he stopped by those that made no [expletive] sense? Who is that? He's coming back in the movie. Like, I know there's something up with, there's something there, because that, that scene just is so incongruent with everything else that is happening. It was intentional. It wasn't just to build, it didn't add to the storyline." And that's no different than HBPRNA and what we talk about when someone, you know, when you're dissecting anything, it's like, "Wait a minute. This doesn't make sense to fit the storyline. This doesn't make sense if you're really going to pick your kid up from wherever or you just came back from the store and you're telling me that no, that, that, that you wouldn't do these things," right? Because it doesn't add to—

That's predictive analysis. We create explanatory storylines for a situation. This, look, if this guy's this pissed, he's going to tip over the table. If this guy's this pissed, he's going to throw a punch. If this guy's this pissed, he's going to say a swear. If this guy's this pissed, he's going to drop his beer and turn around and storm out of the place and squeal off. Okay? So, there's, let's say, five or six possible, and they're much more likely than the 140th one is the guy's going to do a ballet thing and turn over and fart. Right? I mean, we can dismiss those. But on those top five, what would happen next to create that likelihood? Well, he would have to ball his fist or lean in or grab the table. So, if it doesn't fit, Brian, the Isotoner must have quit. If it does not fit, we have to look at it and say, "Is this a sound hypothesis?" What is that called? Scientific hypothesis testing. Testing, right? So, so the problem with small control samples is that you come up with skewed, unvaried results that might not inform you of a likelihood. We have an advantage because it's billions upon billions of people that go through their day every day repeating the behavior. So, our our sample is significantly larger and has been tested for thousands of years.

And so, here's, here's the analogy to, to sort of real life. You don't, when you're observing a situation, a person, whatever, you're not starting at the beginning of the movie. You're coming in at some point on that timeline. And that's where your observation starts. And you, unless someone told you, unless you got to review something, unless you had some information, you don't know everything that led up to it. But even small pieces of information can allow you to infer what likely occurred before and therefore what likely is going to occur next. So meaning, if you, so, so we just talked about movies for 40 minutes. You can go drop into whatever, let's say like action movies. Those things are like set [expletive] storyline. All of them are exactly the same. Which why I don't get into like all the Marvel superhero ones and all the CGI stuff. It's just not for me. It's not my thing. Because protracted fight—

Well, well, and they're, they're, they're lame to me. Like, you always say to like, "Wait, you've got all this power, all this technology, all this, this, then why is it always come end up with a fist fight between two guys?" Exactly.

And it's always that way. "I come from another planet." They're extremely, they're extremely popular because they're fun and they're exciting, they're entertaining, and it's wild to see what you can do with that stuff. I, I, I, they're impressive. It's just not my thing. But, but the idea is, you know, even though you can walk into the middle of any major big popular movie, watch it for five minutes and come up with, "Okay, here's what I think this movie is about and here's where the characters—" you're going to get a lot of that, right? You're not going to get the whole thing. You're not going to get everything because everything fits a set sort of pattern. There's, there's subtle small details are going to be different. But the big storylines are going to fit a certain pattern. So, that all I need to do is figure out what's the big storyline here, right? And that, that'll allow me to create those options that I need or create, uh, potential outcomes or those hypothesis to test within the situation.

So, there's a great copper out there that's come to our course, and we've, we've talked to him before on various issues. Greg Primm. And Primm does exactly what you do in his daily life. Yes, he has to quickly assess the surroundings based on all the things that he knows and the experiences that he's had. And there's a story that goes along with the stuff that he's watching. And guess what, when everything fits that story, it feels pretty good. But every once in a while, he comes up with something that doesn't fit the storyline. And he goes, and he makes a traffic stop, and he scores. What he had trouble with is turning around and explaining that. Yes. In a manner. Now, I'm not saying he lost any cases and didn't write reports and couldn't testify. I'm saying he didn't see the HBPRNA, which opens up, Brian, when you're driving, a movie is like the windshield on your car. I show you what I want you to see. HBPRNA is like sitting on the roof of your car on that holy [expletive]. You know, it's the HMAN, Brian. I can see 360 up and down and backwards, and I can feel the wind in my face. So the idea was that Primm was able to take our information and go so much further. And he's constantly on a search. We know a lot of people that are always out there searching. But I love knowing that we've given somebody the opportunity to look at something and literally and figuratively pick it up off the table and turn it around in their hand and see what's really going on. And a film doesn't allow us to do that. So that's why films are so important because we have to fill in the blanks. They can't tell us everything. Shelley and I have a term, and you just mentioned it but with different terminology, "They did that for us." So, we'll see a part of a film and they'll, you know, flash something for a minute, and it's like, "Okay, they did that for us." Or the guy said, "Well, you remember Tommy when we were younger?" "They did that for us." They had to give us something now, so we would extrapolate that information later. And life does that. We call those pre-event indications of something. Right? So, whenever I see cues and clusters of cues in my environment, I come up with likelihood, and that's the key. So, so when we watch a film, you and I watch it a little differently because we're constantly using different lenses.

Yeah. And sometimes we'll watch the film two or three times to make sure that we caught, what we think the message was.

And, you know, you brought up the, the per— that's a perfect example, you know, in film and then in life, is that it's that the film you're watching, it's forced perspective. You only get what that director had in mind for you to see, right? So, so that's what other people will try to do, and only, whether it's for nefarious purposes, illegal purposes, or something they don't want you to do, bamboozle you, to pickpocket you, or during an interview to lie to you.

Exactly.

Is that forced perspective. But over here, but here's the thing: in real life, you get to do that. You don't get to, you don't have to sit in the car and stare at the windshield. You can stop, you can pull over, you can take a look around, you can look up out of the window, you look at the rearview mirror. That's, I mean, that's, that's, that's the difference in life is that, you know, in those movies, it's so forced, and you only get what they want. And people will try to do that to you, but you, you get to the, you get everything, right? You get to look around a little bit. You get to step left or right and see it from that different perspective. You get to turn around, what's coming behind you. So, I, but, you know, it's just a great way of understanding how we get sucked in to staring and looking and watching at something that is meaningless, you know what I mean? Or, or doesn't matter as much as we think it does.

So, so, so you're so spot on. And remember, folks, when we talk about reboots, we're talking about films that have been made over and over and over. A perfect example, Brewster's Millions has been made. Very simple thing. I've got to spend a million without amassing any property value or any tangible things, and then I get 10 million at the end of the day kind of thing. That's been remade six or eight times, you know. A Christmas Carol, over 20 times. So, when we take a look at those, we have to think of, when the formula works, people jump at it. So, can I give evidence of that yet? So, Brian, during the 50s and 60s, the most popular TV shows, serials, movies, everything on, was Westerns. Westerns. And so, a psych student asked me one time at Western, no, no pun intended, why was that? And so, my thing is, well, if you have a lot of volcanoes or there was a lot of bad weather or there was a lot of plane hijackings, you can expect very quickly two or three movies to come out about that. A lot of scripts going out about that because people want to avail themselves of it.

But when it comes to Westerns, take a look at how people think. Even European people go, "Oh, cowboy, bang bang! I get it." Right? And then what do we think? The white hat and the black hat, and the good and the evil. And man, "God made people, but, you know, Colt, you know, made this guy more powerful," whatever the code is. I don't give a [expletive] about it. But, but you understand that you couldn't get away from Bonanza and Gunsmoke and The Rifleman, Wagon Train, Have Gun – Will Travel. And that even carried over to the cartoons that were made. And you talked about prequels and sequels. So, if Hollywood was still doing Westerns, we would have Have Gun – Will Travel: High School Edition. We would have Wagon Train before the wagon was built. And it would be a red wagon, and they would be doing it in the art of the guy's house. Look, we even have Muppet Babies. Why? Because Muppets are popular. So, if I can take the baby Muppets, maybe a kid'll associate. Right?

I saw a commercial the other day, and they had a guy going down in, which looked like an ice cream truck, and a bunch of kids ran him down, and it was about sports, watching sports on TV. It had nothing to do with ice cream and [expletive], and the kids were going, "Oh, so I'll watch with my parents." "Yeah, and I'll watch alone. And I'll watch the playoffs that are coming up." Listen, Hollywood makes those type of commercials because they also make sports books in Vegas. And I want to start people spending money on their phones earlier and earlier. That's not film, that's not that genre. That's using these masterful arts for the dark side. And you were just touching on that, right? That's showing a Japanese person with the yellow skin and the slanted eyes, or a Nazi with the big helmet. And so, it's a propagandist or a psychological warfare way of looking at it. That's not what we're talking about. We're talking about when something seems to be popular, everything follows suit. Why? Because it works. When somebody comes up with a new burger or sandwich, the competitors have to come up with one too. So, so we drive the industry by driving to the industry to watch the film. And the more we take [expletive] from those films, you know, the crappy films, the more crappy films they're going to throw at us.

Yeah, yeah, that, that, that's, you can even get in that with the, the big major films where they have, they shoot multiple endings and multiple storylines and they have focus groups to see which one goes well. And it's like, you know, it's not really a creative vision anymore. It's just literally falling into that algorithm that, "I know it's going to be a hit and it's going to make a ton of money." It's, it's not even about telling a compelling story. It's just, you know, it, it's literally just, "We're going to make this because we know it's going to do $100 million in the box office." And so, I mean, which that's the, the, the business side of it, of course. Um, but, you know, there's so many different, um, analogies in, in the movie and TV industry that there are just to real life because of that. And, and again, it goes back to, it's really hard to be novel and creative and do something that like, where you can't, where you won't get caught.

It's hard for a criminal than it is a terrorist. Exactly. Right. It's HBPR 101. Why do we both love Christopher Walken? Because Christopher Walken decides the pace of his speech. He decides how he's going to read it. He takes out all of the periods and exclamation points and does his own thing that only, only works for him. Yes, that's what nobody else— Okay, Kevin Spacey. When Kevin Spacey goes off the rails, you know, and say, "Shut your mouth and listen to what I say," all that, that's him. It's become yet, and I bet there's a big part of that in his real life too.

I think so, from what I've heard.

I don't want to get sued with that one because I think he was on a rant. Remember that video you sent me about Epstein's release? But the idea here is that I revere Kevin Spacey as an actor because when you watched The Usual Suspects, whether you loved it or you hated it, how he was manipulative and how he moved through that character, it was amazing to watch. Pulp Fiction. Walken's role in Pulp Fiction stole the film for me. Okay, because when I had watched—

Yeah, it was magic.

Nobody else could, could you imagine that stage read? Which leads me to a great film. You and I both know this: the story about The Front Page. And The Front Page was remade with His Girl Friday. And so you got Cary Grant that goes in with Rosalind Russell, Ralph Bellamy, all those other people, and are all reading for the roles. And every single time His Girl Friday was made from The Front Page, which has been remade 25 times. Walter Burns and his partner, his news partner, the reporter—remember, there was written news and newspapers. He was going to leave. And so he tried to get his, his Hildy, his partner, to come back. And it was always two males, two males, two males. So, as they were sitting in the room with Cary Grant and Ralph Bellamy doing the cold reading on the script, right, for who was going to be the characters, the male part that was going to play Hildy couldn't make it. So one of the producers had his female secretary, "Hey, do me a favor. Step in and read it." And all of them at once had the epiphany moment, Brian. They go, "Holy [expletive]! We can redo this whole film with a male and a female character, and now we've got all this other stuff!" I love that. To me, that's magic. To me, that's somebody, you know, doing the Christopher Walken, showing me something that I didn't see before. You know, the, the, the idea of them being able to take that film and putting a different spin on it. I love that.

Now I have to walk that back because they just made Winnie the Pooh as a serial killer. And it's, you know, Blood on the Honey or whatever.

Oh, yeah.

And so they just came out with Mickey Mouse, which is going to be released very soon. Mickey Mouse as a serial killer and does all the Friday that's you're trying to— Yeah, so I, you get what I'm saying? That's changing some— Not interested. Not interested in blood and gore and violence. I've had enough in my life. I don't need to see a [expletive] movie. All I got to do is close my eyes. You know what I'm saying? Or get with you and cry in the rental car all the way to the training. But when you take a look at the films that are the most remade films, there's one of two things that sticks out to me, Brian. One, moneymaker. Own a feed moneymaker. Or the second, A Star Is Born. People are fragile and they're vulnerable. And when they become successful, they delve into womanizing and drugs and everything else, which by the way, is The Sopranos 101 and everything that you saw in Godfather all the way up to the last one. Dracula and Frankenstein. Why did those come? Because you know what? I heard a bump in the night and I created all kinds of [expletive] for it. Right? The science going too far. Frankenstein nobody even knows unless they actually read the book, you know, Frankenstein going up into the Antarctic and being alone on— There's magic there. Magnificent Seven. Kurosawa did The Seven Samurai. Robin Hood. Why Robin Hood is one of the most remade films of all time. Why, though? Because what's the point there? "Hey, get back at the man." You know what I'm saying? I love that. Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. What if you walked by a butcher shop and you thought, "Man, if I worked there, I'd be 400 pounds because I like me some hamburger," or whatever? Right? Those things are going to constantly be popular in film. You know what I can't get behind? I can't get behind Avatar. And I, I sound like a [expletive] because Avatar might be a great film. But now they made Avatar: Way of Water. I heard that next one coming out, Avatar: Way of Sand. Then it's Avatar: Way of Chocolate. Holy [expletive]! How many times can you use these sea monkeys and turn them into something that I want to watch? You know?

Yeah, no, and that's, that's the, this is where it comes at that, you know, obviously individual taste or, or what we see in the films. And back to socialization. And, and then to like the predictive part of it. When I'm like, you know, once, obviously, because we're, we're primed, we do pattern recognition and analysis, like you, once you see it, it's kind of like, "Oh, I kind of know what's coming." I don't know it specifically. I can't tell you, "Oh, at this minute someone's going to walk in and that's when the shooting starts." It's like, "All right, then this is going to happen." So, there has to be something engaging in there for me to get into those movies. And, yeah, but the big, the CGI one stuff too, is it, it's, it's like, and, and Kaylie always gives me [expletive]. She's like, "You don't like out of these because there was like, 'Oh, that's not how it really happens.'" Or I go, "Yeah, but if I'm going to suspend disbelief and I'm going to get into it, I can do that. It just, it has to be engaging on a level where I, I'm not sure where it's going to go. So, there's some novelty there and, and, and there's a little bit of suspense for—"

Or you're in a coma, Brian.

Yeah.

So listen, I'm a huge J.R.R. Tolkien fan. From The Silmarillion on up. I've read J.R.R. Tolkien [expletive] he's written on a napkin. Why? Because I think it's fascinating that this guy came up with a world and a language and such robust fidelity, characters and such unique and guess what? It's, it's A Seven Samurai over and over and over. Okay? Yeah. But he didn't have those next to him when he was writing. He was in this fantastic place. Now, I don't binge-watch. I can't watch more than a few minutes of when the films come on because I was duped by the books and I felt myself there. So I go, "Oh, that's who they got to play that," or, I'll, I'll see Smaug the Dragon go in and I'll go, "Well, I was a little different." So I actually love Tolkien, but I hate the films.

Well, that's a weird thing from, from, well, that's because, you know, if you read it as a book and then you watch the movie, it's, it's going to be different than the story you created in your head. Because when you're reading it from a book, obviously you're creating the characters, it's all, all the information is in there. But your brain puts those together what it looks like and what it feels like, what it smells like and all that. So then, that's why a lot of people go, "Well, I like the book better than the film." It's because that was someone else's vision of that story. And that's, that's all stories. That's all information, whether they're real, whether it's fiction, whether anything. You create the storyline in your head and it's different. Even when you're watching the film, you're still, you're creating something that's different. It's a different experience for you than it is the person sitting next to you because, right? They're adding in their own details or own attributes or, or personality traits on that individual that may not even be represented on the screen. But we—

Exactly. But we created them. You know what I'm saying? We, we built them in our mind and are solid. And you just touched on the physiological again and the psychological. The safety net. Brian, when I don't have to work very— my brain and body loves sitting in a chair and not having to walk the dog and not having to go outside and shovel the snow, not having to get up and walk downstairs to the gym because my leg hurts a little today. Right? The films that we love the most allow us to sit back and go, "Here we go again!" It's like heroin, man. And it really is because we get the same synaptic high and low from those films. As a matter of fact, that's why when we hear a couple of, you know, notes from a song, or the intro voice from the movie, or whatever it is, the Gilbert Gottfried in the background. We're there, man! We're immediately transported there. And we all know that it's your mind's ability to create those connections and to refer to those connections is why things like mastery work. We love that high, we love those lows. Brian, crying is absolutely essential to humans and it flushes our system and releases endorphins that are very powerful to us. Laughing does exactly the same. You think that's accidental? Come on. And what is the sign for Hollywood? The happiness and the tragedy. You know, the sadness. Come on. I mean, people knew that, Brian. Our stoics were talking about that on the steps of the porn theater, you know, thousands of years ago. You know, Brian, they were only wearing togas. Yeah, bet they were going all the time. There's a lot going on. But that's why I, I mean, I loved when you came to me with the idea moments before we filmed that, "We're not going to just talk about songs. Hey, we're going to talk about film." Because you know how much I love it. And the films that I love are always ones that take me places. They make me laugh, or they make me cry, or they make me anticipate something that's going to happen. Go, "I see what you did there. And that's clever. I love that [expletive]!" You know, that's Mike Myers' line, by the way. May I add just one more thing for you?

Sure.

You were talking about Freddie Mercury, which you looked like a week ago. I did. And acted like for the last 10 years. But the idea is that Mercury's portrayal by that great young actor— Rami Malek, I think, his name is— he did such a great job. And I got to watch that film because you and I were traveling a lot and it was one that I could get on my phone that was long enough and it had music and it had a little interest. So I watched that, and you said, "Hey, the protracted use of the too many teeth and all that other stuff." I think they, you know, overdid that. When a movie goes so far that they have to be exact, they go right back to our AI-VR fight. "I need to make everything exact. I need to make the type of holster and make sure that it's got the recoil and shape." Stop. You don't need it. Stop. All you got to do is get me there. I'll do the rest. Yeah, again, we're back to masturbation. But the idea is all you have to do is give me the vehicle. The film is a vehicle for me to experience all these profound, life-altering emotions. And that's why you don't need to go too far.

Yeah, no, and that's, that's what you see that on, on, on too many where they, where they explain it too much or they go too far. I mean, it's back to your Sopranos. When I watched that, when they came out a couple years ago with like, they came out with a movie, like a follow-up, sort of like it's, it was like a prequel of everything that had before. And it was, it was, it was good. It was, I, I got into it. But it was like too on the nose and too like, they went into too much detail. Like there was a scene where it was baby Christopher and it was a young Tony. And like Christopher was fine with everyone else and didn't like Tony. But then they had to like point, like it was obvious, but then they were like, "Oh, wow, like he, he doesn't like Tony. Wow, they're foreshadowing the fact that Tony ends up killing him or whatever." But like, did it, was like, "You don't have to go. You're going too far. Like just, just, just, you know, make subtle hints. Don't, don't—"

Back. We're back to talking the HMAN series that that we're working currently with Milo on. But anybody, knock on the door, we're interested. The idea is that when we create AI and VR, we have to fight the urge to build the entire Millennium Falcon. You get what I'm trying to say? Because when they did that, Han and Luke were the most important thing, not the visual effects. It was what might happen next. And so those ideas, Brian, that's the best films in the world. The best films have a good plot. And again, if they don't go too long, we have fun. And you know what? It's just like a roller coaster. I get off the roller coaster, I get back in line. Why? Endorphins. I don't get back in line for any other reason other than the chemicals that made me feel in a certain way. I want to do it again. And you know who doesn't get back on? The kid that vomited at the top. That kid's probably not going to go back there. So, so don't make me vomit at your film, I think is the tagline here. The idea is, man, look, film can transform your life. So, it's just like music, just like literature. And if you understand more about HBPRNA, you're going to enjoy film more. You really are.

Yeah. Okay. Well, I think that's a good, that's a good spot to end on unless you have any other—

I wanted to do one more Christopher Walken. Oh, God. I can't do a Kevin Spacey. Shelley does a great Kevin Spacey. Next time you're with Shelley when Shelley talks office politics and she goes the Kevin Spacey route, it's hilarious. You got to watch. Yeah, it's, it's you, you always kind of devolve somehow to Gilbert Gottfried on all your impressions. Gottfried, I don't know why. I don't know why. Exactly.

Everything in my life is that commercial where Gottfried was the goose or the duck. If, if, if Seth MacFarlane falls through, he's doing the audiobook for the textbook as the voice of Peter Griffin. We can't, we can't get him, then we'll get Gilbert Gottfried.

First of all, that's insulting, and I get it, and it's funny, so I'll allow it. But I think that it should, for you, it should be Morgan Freeman.

Oh, that'd be great. Morgan Freeman. He's got a great voice.

Yeah, he can. And then for me, it should be Gottfried. So no matter what I do, like in the textbook, even during the episode, "Chapter 4." You know, you know, the book on tape. We talk about that. Stephen Dunphy, you know, trying to get somebody. I don't want talking. I always hear me. I want somebody else talk.

That'd be funny though. I like the Peter Griffin one. Yeah, I know that'd be good.

I think that would be hilarious. "You know what grinds my gears?" So, it's true. I look like him about as much as he does.

That's good.

Well, now that I'm insulted, I got to go eat.

We always have more on the Patreon site for those who are listening, and we got some big changes coming up there. It's going to be great. And I think everyone's going to like, and we got some great feedback from our Patreon folks on that. So, so we, stay tuned in the next few weeks here as we kind of change a little bit on the podcast. Still going to be us, still doing what we're doing, but I think we'll, we'll be able to to really knock it out of the park for everyone listening. So, we thank everyone for listening. We appreciate it. And don't forget that training changes behavior.